New complete guide for ships on POTC New Horizons

That's a bit surprising...
"Lugger1" was a stock game ship.

There was a "Lugger1" in the stock game. Whether it's the same "Lugger1" that is in NH is another matter. Or @CatalinaThePirate might simply have signed the wrong ship.

That one too?
I had that in memory for the "LuggerVML", which was custom-made by the Russian modders from Seaward.Ru .

Yes, both ships have the commands for tan sails in "Ships_init.c". Probably because, having gone to a lot of effort to get them into the game, I wanted to make sure they'd be seen. "LuggerVML", alias "heavy lugger", is the most visible because that's the one you get at the start of "Tales of a Sea Hawk". "Lugger3" got them as well, as did the older-looking polacca and one of the tartanes.

Perhaps the reason was as simple as "testing if it works".

I can't see who added that code; but I do see I myself added a "unique" exception right next to it.
But that one does something slightly different.
(Or perhaps it does effectively do the same thing after all...? Just in a ruder way...?)

The odd thing is that "LuggerCT" is the only ship with the "noNatStatMod" attribute. "Unique" is different, it blocks both national modifiers and randomisation, so the ship gets exactly what's in "Ships_init.c". "noNatStatMod" only blocks national modifiers but allows randomisation. While I was checking again for mistakes and errors on my guide, I found out that some ships seem to perform worse than it should be (or in some cases, too good for their class). I thought I would leave here the ships I think need some changes and buffs (or nerfs). It isn't neccessary to do these changes for next patch; this could be seen as thoughts for future patches or releases.

Armed Schooner: Right now it's not that bad, but I think it needs to increase its agility or its cargo capacity to be more interesting, since it has almost no armament. For example, increasing its HP and cargo from 900 to , and increase its "Arcade" speed from 14.5 to 15.0, and its turn rate from 38.0 to at least 40.0.
English Bark (vanilla model): Its speed needs to be improved in order to perform at least similiar to the European Barque. For example, from 12.7 to 14.0. Besides that, if speed remains the same, I suggest increasing its cargo from to , and its HP from to .
Naval Ketch: It's actually not competitive as a military ship. It needs some important buffs in order to perform a similar role to the Naval Cutter, although inferior to it. For example, increasing its HP from to ; its speed from 10.0 to at least 13.5-14.0, and its Max-Min crew from 38-8 to at least 45-9.
Caravela Redonda: It is currently in an inferior position to the other caravels, so it could use some improvement. For example, increasing its speed from 12.0 to 12.5; its turn rate from 30.0 to 34.0-36.0; its cargo capacity from to -; and its Max Crew from 70 to 80.
Pinnace (Dutch): Needs some improvements to be more competitive to the other pinnaces. For example, increasing its HP from to at least ; its cargo capacity from to at least -. Its cargo capacity should be higher than the medium pinnace, as well as its HP. If changes are done to this ship, then Medium Pinnace won't need any change.
Heavy Brig (NH model): It should receive a nerf to its HP, since it's not normal that a Brig could have more HP than heavy frigates. For example, reducing its HP from to a maximum of .
East Indiaman: This ship should receive a small buff to its agility, although right now it's not bad. For example, increasing its speed from 11.5 to at least 12.0; and its turn rate from 30.0 to 32.0-33.0.
American Brig (USS Enterprise): It should receive a level increase to the maximum caliber of its guns at a minimum, from 4 to 6. The other alternative is to put it down to tier 6, lowering its crew, and altering some of its stats to balance it in its new tier.
Light East Indiaman: As it is right now, it is more of a military ship rather than a merchant one. It should receive some modifications. For example, reducing its HP, which is a bit excessive in my opinion, from to a maximum of ; reducing its maximum caliber from 18 to at least 12, or 9 to better resemble its "light" status; and also reducing its crew from 200-54 to 160-38.
Treasure Galleon: It should increase its speed from 8.0 to 9.0-10.0 to be at least more competitive.

So while I was playing, I had just found around the coast of Nevis a 4th Rate Warship of the Royal Navy (the one based on the stock Fearless). As you might remember, in Ships_init.c, there is a Royal Navy model that has 52 cannons, instead of the standard 44 cannons. I went close to the side of the ship, and took a screenshot to see why it had more cannons. Here is the result.

View attachment

On the starboard side I counted 23 cannons. Having another 23 on port, 4 on stern, and 2 on bow, gives you the total of 52 cannons. It seems there are "artificial" cannons put onto that model.

The trouble is that while the model may show cannons there, it does not have firing locators for them. And the firing locators which it does have are not lined up with the cannons. Here is the hull model as seen in "GM Viewer":

It shows all locators regardless of which side they're on. The firing locators are those beginning with "_". So "_29", "_88", "_89" and "_90" are the stern guns. "_77" and "_78" are out of position and the guns aft of them have no locators at all. On the upper gun deck, "_81" to "_85" are about right but there are no firing locators aft of "_85". ("_85" is obscured here by some other locators for ropes and shrouds.) In fact, regardless of what "Ships_init.c" says, this ship can only fire 40 guns because its firing locators appear to be the same as those of "Lineship1", alias "5th Rate Warship". The same applies to other variants of "4th Rate Warship", and for that matter, the original stock game "Fearless". And they aren't going to be easy to fix...

There was a "Lugger1" in the stock game. Whether it's the same "Lugger1" that is in NH is another matter. Or @CatalinaThePirate might simply have signed the wrong ship.

Perhaps the lugger paint schemes got jumbled around a bit in the Big Ship Texture Cleanup of the 's.
We got rid of a fair bit of redundant stuff at some point.

Yes, both ships have the commands for tan sails in "Ships_init.c". Probably because, having gone to a lot of effort to get them into the game, I wanted to make sure they'd be seen.

And rightly so!
They look very "Dutch brown fleet" so I'm quite in favour.

The odd thing is that "LuggerCT" is the only ship with the "noNatStatMod" attribute. "Unique" is different, it blocks both national modifiers and randomisation, so the ship gets exactly what's in "Ships_init.c". "noNatStatMod" only blocks national modifiers but allows randomisation.

True.
And yes, odd indeed.
Maybe @Nathan Kell has any memories?
Or...
Was @Mad Jack Wolfe around back then as well...?

And the firing locators which it does have are not lined up with the cannons.

EEEEWWWW! That's some UGLY locator-work!!
For an already ugly ship model...

I do seem to have some recollection that (@Nathan Kell?) put in some code so that if you have extra/not enough cannons for your number of locators,
some refuse to fire; or fire double; so at least you do get the correct number of shots.
This is relevant of course for the "cannons being damaged" mod. Which was, I think, @konradk's.
So perhaps that was him who added that altogether, actually...

Armed Schooner: indeed, compared to other ships, its arcade performance seems low compared to its realistic performance. Arcade speed can go up to 15.5, turn rate to 50. Corsair Schooner, which is a better armed, pirate version of the same ship, also gets its arcade performance boosted to match.

Caravela Redonda: almost looked at the wrong ship because that's also the realistic mode name for what arcade mode calls "square-rigged caravel". It's also the name for a Portuguse ship which would be perhaps better renamed "carrack". It's an older-looking design than the other caravels with higher superstructure and is indeed an inferior design. Possibly reduce its period chance in "Spanish Main" so you don't see as many of them in the later period.

Dutch pinnace vs. medium pinnace: the Dutch pinnace loses some cargo capacity because it has a heavier armament. It's also slower in realistic mode, but the same speed in arcade mode. So the Dutch pinnace will be slightly slowed down in arcade mode. HP can stay as it is; this is a pinnace, not a frigate!

USS Enterprise: this was an earlier attempt to make a more realistic version of the Interceptor. The model has a few more guns than the Interceptor but not enough to justify over double the crew size. Possibly either increase its speed and turn to match "US_Interceptor" and "RN_Interceptor" (American Brig), or drop their performance to match "US_Enterprise" - at present they're slightly slower than the fantasy "HMS_Interceptor". In any case, "US_Enterprise" crew can drop to 65 compared to 57 for the other two.

Treasure Galleon: could indeed do with a boost to its arcade speed, as other ships have higher arcade speed than realistic speed while this one has them the same. Realistic speed stays at 8, arcade speed goes up to 9.5.

Dutch Pinnace: If HP remains the same, I suggest lowering the HP for the vanilla model of the Pinnace, and also for the Merchant Pinnace, in order to be consistent with the Pinnace line.
Caravela Redonda: I think your solution would be the best for it.
USS Enterprise: I think it's best to drop it at Tier 6, with its stats also balanced for that tier. But you can choose whatever you think it's best.

Further changes:
Armed Schooner (and Corsair Schooner, which is the same ship with a heavier armament for use by pirates) get the arcade speed and turn rate improvements suggested.
European Barque: the arcade speed is reduced to be comparable with realistic speed. The Barque Longue and Jackass Barque also needed their arcade speeds reduced.
Fast Galleons: the arcade speed is increased - at present they're the same as Fast War Galleons, whereas in realistic mode they're faster than Fast War Galleons.
East Indiaman: should indeed have a slightly better turn rate than Heavy East Indiaman but its turn rate in arcade mode is the same. So its arcade turn rate can be slightly increased in line with its realistic turn rate.

European Barque: So you mean you are going to reduce their stats to be similar to the English Bark? That could probably cause that players would stick more with luggers because of their better speed. Why do you think it is necessary to reduce their speed? (Besides balancing with "Realistic" speed of course).

If you want, I can include all the changes you will do to the ships' stats that you mentioned. If you share with me the specific changes, I can include them for the next release.

Dutch Pinnace: If HP remains the same, I suggest lowering the HP for the vanilla model of the Pinnace, and also for the Merchant Pinnace, in order to be consistent with the Pinnace line.
Caravela Redonda: I think your solution would be the best for it.

Merchant Pinnace: capacity , armament 26 guns of 9lb, crew 120, HP , price , speed 8.5/12.6, turn 60/29
Medium Pinnace: capacity , armament 18 guns of 9lb, crew 117, HP , price , speed 9.5/12.6, turn 60/29
Vanilla Pinnace: capacity , armament 24 guns of 9lb, crew 108, HP , price , speed 9.0/12.6, turn 60/29
Dutch Pinnace: capacity , armament 26 guns of 9lb, crew 117, HP , price , speed 9.0/12.6, turn 60/29

So the Merchant Pinnace has a couple more guns, crew to man them, and is a bit slower. The Medium Pinnace is the fastest of the lot, and the lightest armed. The Dutch Pinnace is the heaviest armed, losing some cargo capacity to make room for the guns. And whoever added the new pinnaces forgot to change the arcade speeds to match the realistic speed, so I'll correct that - Merchant to 12.1, Medium to 13.1, the others stay as they are. Otherwise, all ships are not created equal! If you're buying, you take whatever the shipyard has on offer or wait to find the type of your choice. If you're capturing one for your own use, the same applies - take what you can find, or dump it and wait for the one of your choice.

Incidentally, those armament values don't tell the whole story. The Medium Pinnace doesn't have much of a broadside because four of its guns are on the stern, while the Vanilla Pinnace has six guns on the stern, very nasty for anyone trying to chase it! The Dutch Pinnace has the heaviest broadside of the lot, but only two stern guns.

USS Enterprise: I think it's best to drop it at Tier 6, with its stats also balanced for that tier. But you can choose whatever you think it's best.

Tier is based purely on the base crew number as given in "Ships_init.c" without national modifiers or randomising, which means dropping its crew to 65 will indeed put into tier 6 - just! Tier 6 is crew less than 100, greater than or equal to 60.

European Barque: So you mean you are going to reduce their stats to be similar to the English Bark? That could probably cause that players would stick more with luggers because of their better speed. Why do you think it is necessary to reduce their speed? (Besides balancing with "Realistic" speed of course).

The entire reason is to balance it with realistic speed so that comparisons between ships should be similar regardless of which setting you use - if ship A is faster than ship B in realistic mode then it should also be faster in arcade mode. (There are probably more which need their arcade speeds adjusted but I haven't the time to check the whole lot!)

In any case, personally I tend to stick with the lugger for speed, turn rate, and the superior ability to sail across the wind. Then I'll take full advantage of that agility to zigzag across the stern of something bigger and pound it with grapeshot until it surrenders. Forget barques, I'm after something bigger!

If you want, I can include all the changes you will do to the ships' stats that you mentioned. If you share with me the specific changes, I can include them for the next release.

European Barque: arcade speed changed from 14.9 to 11.9, Jackass Barque arcade speed changed from 15.3 to 13.3, English Barque (New Horizons) arcade speed changed from 14.9 to 12.7, Barque Longue arcade speed changed from 15.6 to 13.6.
Heavy Brig (New Horizons): HP changed from to .
Dutch Pinnace: arcade speed changed from 12.6 to 12.0.
Fast Galleon: arcade speed changed from 12.5 to 13.5.
American Brig (USS Enterprise): crew changed from 144 to 65 (which drops it from tier 5 to tier 6).
East Indiaman: arcade turn rate changed from 30 to 32.
Treasure Galleon: arcade speed changed from 8.0 to 9.5.
Armed Schooner arcade speed changed from 14.5 to 15.5, arcade turn rate changed from 38 to 50. Corsair Schooner arcade speed changed from 14.3 to 15.5, arcade turn rate changed from 35 to 50.
Caravela Redonda: Spanish Main period chance changed from 0.6 to 0.4. This probably doesn't affect your guide, it just means this antiquated ship becomes less visible in the early 17th century.

Merchant Pinnace: capacity , armament 26 guns of 9lb, crew 120, HP , price , speed 8.5/12.6, turn 60/29
Medium Pinnace: capacity , armament 18 guns of 9lb, crew 117, HP , price , speed 9.5/12.6, turn 60/29
Vanilla Pinnace: capacity , armament 24 guns of 9lb, crew 108, HP , price , speed 9.0/12.6, turn 60/29
Dutch Pinnace: capacity , armament 26 guns of 9lb, crew 117, HP , price , speed 9.0/12.6, turn 60/29

So the Merchant Pinnace has a couple more guns, crew to man them, and is a bit slower. The Medium Pinnace is the fastest of the lot, and the lightest armed. The Dutch Pinnace is the heaviest armed, losing some cargo capacity to make room for the guns. And whoever added the new pinnaces forgot to change the arcade speeds to match the realistic speed, so I'll correct that - Merchant to 12.1, Medium to 13.1, the others stay as they are. Otherwise, all ships are not created equal! If you're buying, you take whatever the shipyard has on offer or wait to find the type of your choice. If you're capturing one for your own use, the same applies - take what you can find, or dump it and wait for the one of your choice.

Fair enough. You take what you can get. They are at least a little different between each other, without losing its overall class stats.

Incidentally, those armament values don't tell the whole story. The Medium Pinnace doesn't have much of a broadside because four of its guns are on the stern, while the Vanilla Pinnace has six guns on the stern, very nasty for anyone trying to chase it! The Dutch Pinnace has the heaviest broadside of the lot, but only two stern guns.

I didn't notice that the dutch pinnace had a more menacing broadside than the other pinnaces. Makes me wonder if I should add the armament disposition of each ship... By any chance, do you know where to look the armament disposition of each ship?

The entire reason is to balance it with realistic speed so that comparisons between ships should be similar regardless of which setting you use - if ship A is faster than ship B in realistic mode then it should also be faster in arcade mode. (There are probably more which need their arcade speeds adjusted but I haven't the time to check the whole lot!)

I understand. I will have to try at least once the realistic mode, and experience the differences. (Would you like me to take a look on the arcade speed of ships that need to be adjusted, and help you?)

In any case, personally I tend to stick with the lugger for speed, turn rate, and the superior ability to sail across the wind. Then I'll take full advantage of that agility to zigzag across the stern of something bigger and pound it with grapeshot until it surrenders. Forget barques, I'm after something bigger!

I wonder why you didn't get you own side quest like Surgeon Peter Blood had... It would be hilarious to end the two parts of the sidequest just to earn a pirate design Heavy Lugger, and seeing it fight against schooners. "I'm a pirate, I don't waste a single gold coin on aquiring my own ship. I will commandeer someone else's ship, even if it's a bigger fish!"

European Barque: arcade speed changed from 14.9 to 11.9, Jackass Barque arcade speed changed from 15.3 to 13.3, English Barque (New Horizons) arcade speed changed from 14.9 to 12.7, Barque Longue arcade speed changed from 15.6 to 13.6.

That puts the entire barque line quite nerfed, but I think that would make it interesting, since those ships now have to, in most cases, fight against pirates and use chains to sail away from them, whereas previously they could simply run away without entering into naval battles.

American Brig (USS Enterprise): crew changed from 144 to 65 (which drops it from tier 5 to tier 6).

I imagine the rest of its stats remain the same, right? That also applies for its price? I think it should be reduced as well.

Caravela Redonda: Spanish Main period chance changed from 0.6 to 0.4. This probably doesn't affect your guide, it just means this antiquated ship becomes less visible in the early 17th century.

Yes, it won't affect it. I didn't include it because I thought that was adding too much unnecessary information.

Ahoy, mateys of the 21st century! Let's take a little jaunt back in time to the 17th and 18th centuries. A time when the world's oceans echoed with the thrilling cry of "Land ho!" and the dreaded black flag fluttered in the wind. So, anchor your modern notions at the door, and let's dive deep into the anatomy of those grand old pirate ships.

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'The sea, the snotgreen sea, the scrotumtightening sea.' While James Joyce might have aptly described the great briny deep, what about the ships that sailed it, especially those of the pirate variety?

1. The Crow's Nest:
Perched high above, like an eagle surveying its domain, the crow's nest was a lookout point. And contrary to popular belief, it wasn't filled with crows, but rather a lone pirate, eyes peeled for sails or land. From this vantage, a lookout could see danger or prize long before the deckhands below. A lonely job, but someone's got to do it, lest they end up sailing straight into the navy's clutches.

2. The Main Deck:
The heart of daily operations. By day, it was a flurry of swabbing, singing, and occasional brawling. But by night, illuminated by lanterns and moonlight, it was the stage for tales of ghostly ships and krakens, weaving a tapestry of myths and legends. In between? Well, perhaps an impromptu jig or two.

3. The Captain's Quarters:
No ordinary cabin, this was the room of the ship's VIP - the captain. Often lavish with plundered luxuries, it offered a respite from the rough sailor's life. As Captain Jack Sparrow might lament, it wasn't just about the rum; it was about the feathered beds, ornate maps, and the occasional stolen chandelier too.

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4. The Galley:
Food? On a pirate ship? The galley, while no Michelin star restaurant, was where the culinary 'magic' happened. Expecting fine dining? Think more hardtack and salt pork. But in the hands of a resourceful ship's cook, even these meager ingredients could be whipped into something... edible.

5. The Brig:
Let's be clear. This wasn't where pirates went for a timeout after refusing to share their toys. The brig was the ship's jail, a cramped, dank space reserved for unruly pirates, or more often, unlucky captives awaiting ransom. It was the sort of place that made even the hardiest buccaneer think twice about mutiny.

6. The Gun Deck:
Here lay the ship's artillery, cannons ready to rain iron on any who dared cross her path. A well-coordinated crew could unleash volley after volley, making their ship a floating fortress. Remember, a pirate's power wasn't just in their ability to swing a cutlass; it was in the deafening roar of their cannons.

7. The Bilge:
Down in the ship's belly, the bilge was its least glamorous part. A collection point for water seepage and, let's be candid, shipboard waste. This was where the bilge rats, real and the human slackers alike, would be found.

So, next time you find yourself daydreaming of life on the open waves, hat rakishly tilted, remember that a pirate ship wasn't just a vessel. It was a universe unto itself, each part playing a crucial role in the grand, swashbuckling ballet of pirate life. Just make sure you know your brig from your bilge before you set sail. Or at least, before you challenge anyone to a duel over it.